Roma and Dakota

These two are our second breeding pair, it consists of father and daughter, a DEH and Nutmeg. We chose Roma to breed back with Dakota because she has a very nice placid temperament, size but having a relatively poor nutmeg colouring (not being as dark as desired), as well as having the genetics that we need in order to produce the colours we are aiming for to show. There are other reasons for this pairing - but that would be giving away too many genetical tips but it has something to do with recessives and their effects on coat colours, the rest, if you're interested you can research yourselves *winks*

Roma and Dakota were placed into a split-tank on the 23rd Februrary 2005, both took to eachother straight away and we were told they would probably do fine if we were to allow them to fully meet. But me being me, wanted to take things slowly, and by the third day we knew they were ready as they were showing all the signs of a successful introduction. So on the 26th, we placed Roma and Dakota's side of the split. The rest is history and they are now happily together, we are currently waiting Roma's next estrus to see if she allows Dakota to mate.

 

29th March

Today Roma and Dakota were mating... Again I have a female that allows the male to mate in broad daylight.. It must've only been 2pm... Hmmmm I don't think I'll be believing websites or books that tell you Gerbils mate or give birth in the evening/night anymore!

Hopefully Roma will have a quicker pregnancy than her mother used to, making us wait 26 days is just unfair! *chuckles*

 

14th April

Roma should now be 16 days pregnant, I can't really see any signs of showing yet... I'm sure Siena used to show as early as two weeks gone. But then Roma isn't Siena and so she may be completely different. I *think* I can tell Roma has put weight on, she seems to be feeling heavy, but not like lead just yet. I think she has the tiniest of bumps on her sides, which most of the time you can't see, but through a little experience I remember that with Siena she used to have little tufts of fur, the fur would normally lie flat with the shape of the body, but as there's a little lump it causes the fur to tuft out... Alteast I remember it being the same with Siena... We'll just have to wait and see *grumbles*

I really hope Roma gives birth before the 26th day, because I'm supposed to be going to london with Uni on what would be her 27th day, if she only gives birth on the 26th then I'll miss their first 2 days... Arghhh I HAVE to be there to make sure the pups all survive. So I've had to ask my brother to check on them every day, make sure none are hidden under bedding etc.

Roma has certainly been showing the behavioural aspects of being pregnant.. Or perhaps that's just how females act around males? I'm not sure! She keeps on putting poor little Dakota in his place, telling him off, boxing etc... Although it can't be aggressive because Dakota will then nose at Roma again and she'll repeat the whole process! *crazy Gerbils*

The most strange thing is that Dakota seems to have really changed, before he was so timid and placid... He'd NEVER climb out of the tank, when he was with Siena or his three sons, I would have to scoop him up to actually get him out. But now, he's climbing out all the time, as soon as I put him back... Out he pops again! And this tank doesn't even have the glass lips on like the others, so it's more difficult to climb out of. Weird. Is he trying to escape Roma or has she had some other kind of influence on him?

19th April

Well I'm still unsure... Sometimes I think she is, and the next minute I decide she's definitely not and she's infertile!

She could be giving birth in two days time and she's barely showing... Damnit, if she doesn't get large soon that'll mean she's gonna give birth way too close to the 26th day and I won't be here! Grrrrrrr

Today we moved them into their nursery tank, just incase she is pregnant but is one of those that never really lets it show... She has a nest box in there, with a lid that isn't glued down so I can take a peek whenever I want... There's also less substrate in there than normal, in order for the pups not to get lost should there be any.

 

 

20th April - Day 22

No pups yet, and I'm not surprised... I was thinking back a few days ago that I thought Roma would give birth on the Thursday, which will be the 23rd day... Now I'm not too sure, she really STILL doesn't look large enough. Which, obviously doesn't bode very well for my hopes of her giving birth before we go to London.

In comparison to Siena she is still looking tiny and feeling much lighter, perhaps though this is because Siena was always and still is a very thin Gerbil... Where as Roma was never as thin as Siena and so the weight gain is not so drastic?

Anyway, here are some photos of Roma:

23rd April

I noticed Roma going into labour at around 11pm, she began the stretches and occasionally licking in order to help any pup coming out... Around half an hour later I was beginning to wonder just how long is it before it begins to get dangerous for the female and they need assistance, well probably around ten minutes later I saw her give birth to the first pup. She began licking more frequently and managed a couple of summersaults trying to get the first born out!

I saw the next four being born and it was at this stage that Roma began to pull the bedding around the pups and so I no longer know how many pups there are - however I would assume she stopped at 4 because of her pulling in the nest to cover herself and her pups. Dakota attempted to help a couple of times, as well as trying to help produce the next litter, but Roma dutifully told him off and has kept near the nest... I've tried using sunflowers to lure her, but didn't have enough time to count and so I am still unsure of the pup count.

Out of the four we have three dark eyed and one red eyed pup... Well I *think* I saw a red eyed pup, but never got a full clear view and so I could be wrong... In which case, oh damnit. Let's just hope if there are four dark eyed pups then the majority are DEH. I am also a little worried over sex ratio, and hopefully it will be split down the middle.

 

 

An hour or so later:

I saw Roma out for a little forage and so took off the lid to their duna, to my surprise she decided to pop out and have a little run on the bed, so I took my chance to quickly count the pups and there are definitely 4, all of which are dark eyed... Argh. I really hope they don't all turn out to be Nutmegs... Now I like Nutmegs, but I AM breeding for Honey's and so having a litter of four Nutmegs could set me back a little and cause me to HAVE to have a third litter instead. Actually, thinking about it... I will definitely have to go for the third litter because it's unlikely we will have the REH or Saffrons that we need after two litters... Hmmmm I'll have to consider this one first, as I don't want to end up with too many pups to be able to look after. In theory we should have had atleast one red eyed pup from the four, as there is a 25% chance of a red eyed and out of the four half of them should be honey and the other half Nutmeg.

 

 

 

Day 1

The pups are still less than 24 hours old now, and seem to be going strong still. Roma is a good mother so far, and they have white little bellies... The tough part is knowing how much I can look at or touch the pups as she doesn't tend to allow me easy access so far, she likes to keep them covered and will usually come to have a look at what I'm upto... I wish I could fully remember what I used to do with Siena... I was probably quite careful in the first couple of days to be sure she was happy - mind I wasn't there for the first four days of her first litter, it was just Pete and he never handled the pups. By the time she had her second litter she was completely used to me. I think that has helped me with Roma, as she was there when Siena had her second litter and so also was there when I was handling them etc and so probably knows what to expect... Just a shame I can't remember! *rolls eyes*

After confiring with Pete it has come to my attention that Roma appears to be doing exactly as Siena did, and he would generally wait until she came out of the tank, that way he could easily have a look in at the nest and count the pups. Hmmm it must've just been me who motored in there not caring! hahahaha, no I wasn't that bad, I am pretty sure with the first litter I was more nervous than she was and so took my time and was careful about disturbing or upsetting her.

I can't believe I'm going to miss the next two days of their development through having to be in London... Knew I should've not bothered going and claiming I don't have enough money. Hmmm perhaps I could just go straight back home lol.

 

Day 1 - over 24 hours old

Well, my brother checked on the pups and at first he could only see three, arghhhhhhh he decided to phone be back later on once he'd checked through the nest box and bedding... A couple of agonising minutes and he phones back saying he'd found the fourth, it just wasn't with the other three - hopefully it had just gone on an adventure itself, or had accidentally been covered up as Roma left the nest.

Hopefuly my brother didn't have too much trouble trying to see the pups - from what he mentioned he said they were running around him, so perhaps it didn't have as many problems as I did with Roma sitting on the pups as I tried to count them *laughing*

Day 3

Although I wasn't actually the one to take these photos, my brother kindly took some whilst I was still in London. They are doing well and Roma gave him a little run for his money before he got to look at the pups, in the end he put a pot of food in the tank to divert her attention! *laughs*

 

Day 4

Well I've finally arrived back and it's quite obvious that the fur is beginning to come through, from what we can tell there are three DEH's and one Nutmeg, but that may just be wishful thinking... Tomorrow we should be able to tell though.

Three DEH's and a Nutmeg on the right.

Day 5

Day 5 and I'm able to take some good, clear close-up shots of the pups and I am almost definite that there are three DEH's!!! Wooooot!

Such a relief, as this now means I will have plenty of Honeys.

 

 

day 6

Today I was on the hunt for more unusual photos of the pups, so photos of the paws, feet, tails etc...

We actually had a little bit of an emergency today, when I was doing the pup count at night before I went to bed I could only find three and kept on going through the nestbox over and over again... Eventually I let Pete know, he checked and then he confirmed he couldn't find a pup left in the nest, so he began searching outside of the nestbox and finally he found the fourth pup! Obviously they are beginning to adventure out.

 

Day 7

Oh no, the pups are a week old today! It can't be that already!!!! Mind, I was away for the first few days and so that's probably why it only feels like they are four days old. Bah!

When trying to take photos this morning the little Nutmeg wouldn't keep still, they really are beginning to get much more active now it's scary how quickly they've just decided to begin walking around.

 

See the nipples and belly fur coming through?

Day 8

Today for some reason Roma has moved the pups out of the nest box and into a corner... I'm not sure whether it's due to it getting pretty warm now, or all the bedding is beginning to smell... Hmmm but I did give them some clean tissue to put into their nest - which they took immediately. So who knows the way of the Gerbil. *shrugs*

It's amazing seeing how much the fur is growing with each day... I can't believe it each morning when I take some photos!

 

little girl

A little boy

Day 9

Aw my babies keep on getting older...

Day 10

The pups are getting very active and becomming more and more difficult to photo now when I take them out. They're walking around like little crocodiles now, as they are walking with their belly off the ground.

 

 

Day 11

The pups are very quickly coming up to two weeks old! In less than a week their eyes will be opening, baaaaah!

 

Day 12

No nice natural light photos for today, had a long day at Uni and so didn't get back until after 7pm and by then the light wasn't good enough... Here are some cute photos anyway.

 

Day 13

The pups are getting more and more wriggly and more and more difficult to photo now - I found a pup on the run today digging in a corner... I think decided to get a movie of it, what happens is it wanders around the tank, Dakota comes up and sniffs, it then finds its way to mum, she sniffs, decides its definitely one of hers and then picks it up and takes it back into the nest! *so cute*

They could be opening their eyes in 4 days! wow, that really isn't far away now and then the real fun begins and I can play with them more and they'll just be reall small cute gerbies.

 

 

Day 14

The pups are getting pretty active now, and are giving their mum a run for her money! I don't think she likes them moving around the tank, she seems a little too on edge for my liking... I hope they're ok and mum calms down soon.

 

 

 

Day 16

Today one pup opened its eye, two more then opened their eyes on Day 17, with the little Nutmeg boy taking until day 18 to have both of his open.

Day 19

The pups ears have suddenly got much larger, and are slightly folded up, they will likely unfold soon and then look like mini gerbs!

I moved their tank onto a different shelving unit, I think that perhaps the smell of the females in the tank below and above are putting Roma on edge, especially since over the last couple of days Siena's tank are all on heat and chasing eachother around in some sort of heat frenzy! So now Roma is sharing a shelf with Nila, the Winter White Hamster and below her are two tanks of males, which hopefully will help calm her down. I also changed the towel that I drape over the tank to a darker colour, and it is bigger than the other, so it covers more of the tank, hopefully giving her more peace. We'll see how things go, I think it's helped but perhaps it's because the pups eyes are open and they're eating solids now?

 

 

Day 20

The pups are beginning to look much more like minature adults now, their ears have unfolded, and are properly protruding from their head. They are venturing around quite a bit now, and I'm not sure how mum will be able to control them... But then she shouldn't really need to because they are eating solids and most likely going to the bathroom by themselves too. I think Roma must just be a particularly protective mother, so whenever I see her beginning to dig to cover the nest area up I put the lid back on and the towel on the tank and leave them alone. I don't think I'll have to do what I did with Siena in putting them in the play tank for hours... However I do need to try to find some sort of middle ground in order to get the pups highly tame and jumping out onto my hand - they're not scared of my hands, just I obviously want them to climb onto me to come out and play.

 

 

Day 21

I've been working with the pups more by placing my hand in the tank and waiting for them to run up my arm, which they have been doing... So it's all looking good. On a side note, Roma seems to be getting suspiciously bigger... I hope she doesn't give birth so soon that the first litter isn't weaned but gives birth early enough that I can leave the pups in to have a little bit of parental experience. If she does give birth soon then that'll mean she hasn't delayed the next litter at all... But hopefully she will hold on for atleast another week or so, she's not obviously showing yet, just looking and feeling chunky right now, so I reckon the earliest would be 6-7 days, hopefully a little longer. I'm still undecided on my plans and whether or not to have a third litter... I guess everything depends upon how many she has in her second litter, if she has 4 or 5 then I will, if she has more I'll keep it at that. The problem is though, how to find out how many she has and when to take Dakota out. Perhaps what I could do is look out for when I can see the pups moving inside her, take Dakota out then, see how many she has and if it's not enough then put Dakota in again etc.

 

 

 

 

 

Day 25

Roma is really looking quite obviously chubby now, but we are at 3 1/2 weeks old now, so with each day the chance of her attacking them lessens. I just hope that she doesn't, as it will mean I'm best off not breeding from any of these pups as we wouldn't want them learning the behaviour. Odd really as Roma has a completely different mothering method to that of her mum Siena, who she did actually help to raise her little brothers and sisters... So I'm not too sure just how learned this behaviour is... It seems more like it depends upon each female. But, I was planning on trying to get hold of a new gerbil to add in some more 'blood' anyway, and so before I next breed which will most likely be next year, I will use this new blood, perhaps get a new female and use one of the males from this litter, as it's unlikely the male would attack the pups, and I would use one from the second litter, which would never experience any kind of driving away.

Anyway, I took some nice photos today of the pups in natural light, although it was a mixture of cloudy and sunny, so some came out better than others... Well here they are!

 

 

 

 

23rd May

The pups have been weaned for around a week now, Roma began refusing to allow them to come close, and camped out in a different nest area rather than the nest box. I began to get worried that she would attack them, but luckily after a day or so she stopped as no doubt they got the idea that they were no longer allowed to nurse. From then, Roma probably allowed herself a week or a few days before giving birth - quite clever when you think about it!

So today the second litter arrived, 6 dark eyed pups... Oh dear, this has ruined my plans for the next generation... Looks like I'll have to get another gerbil from elsewhere in order to still be able to produce the colours I want to. Either that or solely breed for DEH... But then I will have loads of DEH probably once the colours of this second litter comes through. So perhaps the next generation will be purely REH and Saffron, I can always use my REH from Siena's first litter, Tye - Roma's brother.

Dakota was seperated from Roma and the pups for the night, as I didn't want Roma to give birth whilst I was asleep. She didn't give birth until around 12pm though, so I got to witness yet another birth! Wow, that's 3 birth's I've seen... Only missed one and I was on Holiday then! I left the male pups in with Roma, incase I wanted to put Dakota back in, and didn't want her to begin attacking the young males. They have now, however been seperated too, now I know there are 6.

 

I checked on the pups, as you do, and also to let Pete see them as he was at work when they were born, and unfortunately I found one dead... I'm not sure what could have happened, because it was completely intact, just not pink, and well... Kinda looked shrivelled - the skin was saggy. As you can see from the above photos, it was not still born. As what Roma did was, give birth to four in a tissue box, she then moved into the nest box and gave birth to another, she went back to the tissue box and picked up two pups, leaving two in the tissue box, then she must've had one more in the nest box. I later moved the two left in the tissue box into the nest box so they were all together. And as you can see, there is a pile of four pups, and two in my hand, all are a nice pink colour. So for some unknown reason, at some point the little pup died *cries*

Atleast the pups seem to be helping with the pups, during the birth three of them were near Roma and helping keeping them warm, when she moved into the nestbox, three stayed on the two pups left in the tissue box - the original birth place, and kept them nice and warm. Since then, every time I have checked, they have always been helping keep the new pups warm and clean them, it seems to be going quite nicely in that respect.

27th May 2005

The pups are doing well, I have been trying to keep Roma as quiet as possible by leaving her to the pups. Hopefully this litter will be more calm and so will Roma, especially as the older pups are helping out with the new pups, they should be able to help Roma deal with them more than Dakota used to... *laughs* He just used to make nests and help clean them but often I would see him sleeping away from the nest.

 

 

I think we have three Nutmegs and two Dark Eyed Honeys, which is a shame, but I guess we're used to having so many Nutmegs these days hahaha.

30th May 2005

The pups have their lovely velvety fur through now, I love this stage of their development... So silky and smooth. They are also becoming more active and so this is the time where they might begin wandering out of the nest - certainly within the next few days or so. I have also been attempting to sex them and so far I think we have 4 males and 1 female!!! Gawd that's the first time I've ever had a litter split like that, normally it is literally 50/50 (unless it's an odd number litter) I really hope it turns out we have more females, it's still a little early to tell as the fur hasn't even begun to come through on the tummy yet.

 

Dakota and the two males from the first litter, a DEH and a Nutmeg.